Thanks Apple...

[RECON RSS DRONE]

A special thanks goes to Apple for releasing the new Mac Pro. The dual i7 core Intel processor model just cut transcode times in half (roughly).

So if you open an r3d in RED Alert! and make a "look" using REDspace or REDlog and curves/saturation, etc. it saves the look to the .rsx file. Then open a bunch of these in RED Rushes and output to whatever format you want (say ProRes or Avid)... your dailies/edit files crunch out MUCH quicker.

Processing speed is RED's friend.

Jim


More... (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=27725&goto=newpost)

[DrewIGR]

That is Great news! I'll be ordering mine as soon as Snow Leopard is shipping with them, and FCS gets its update. All this plus a scarlet in one summer? It seems too good to be true...

[Stefan Christou]

Money...

[Yannick Hagman]

Money...

You can always focus on photography. :)

[Granty]

Money...

In the words of ABBA:

"Money, money, money
Must be funny
In the rich man's world
Money, money, money
Always sunny
In the rich man's world
Aha-ahaaa
All the things I could do
If I had a little money
It's a rich man's world"

Never a truer word spoken.

[Dances With Cameras]

I could buy 3 PCs for that.

[geoffreyEUGENEivie]

Money...
That is why I bought the Mac Box Set (have not installed it yet.) I just barely meet the system requirements to run iMovie. Ha Ha Ha. I will have to buy a whole new system when the time comes to edit 3K.

[shaocaholica]

I could buy 3 PCs for that.

Not really. Try pricing a dual socket Core i7 PC with the same parts and the Apple pricing isn't that bad. Especially since there are no dual socket Core i7 boards on the market yet. However that nice price ratio will change with time as Apple likes to keep its prices relatively level despite market trends.

[Peter Majtan]

I agree with Shao - You can't spec out a cheaper HW for the same config & quality. We have just "outquoted" HP with almost the same specs (actually lower then the Mac Pro)...

The is a difference between "being expensive" and "costing a lot". With Apple You really get what You pay for...

:D Peter

[Luke Stewart]

No one's bothering to thank Intel for creating the Core i7 CPU that makes all this possible? Well thanks Intel!!!

[geoffreyEUGENEivie]

We know what Steve thinks of Blu-ray. No one knows what he thinks of Red-ray.

I want my fruit to burn discs.

http://origin.arstechnica.com/journals/apple.media/bag_of_hurt.jpg
http://edibleapple.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/ifruit.jpg

[Pietro Impagliazzo]

Not really. Try pricing a dual socket Core i7 PC with the same parts and the Apple pricing isn't that bad. Especially since there are no dual socket Core i7 boards on the market yet. However that nice price ratio will change with time as Apple likes to keep its prices relatively level despite market trends.

Since I price checked a dual Xeon PC configuration, beginning of last year or something like this, it was cheaper to go for a PC config (Skulltrail) than Mac.

I'd be surprised if when Intel releases a PC dual processed motherboard for PC the config would be more expensive.

No one's bothering to thank Intel for creating the Core i7 CPU that makes all this possible? Well thanks Intel!!!

Yeah, lol...
Nice catch.

:thumbsup:

[Dances With Cameras]

I'd bet on Blue-Torrent. :bath:
Or Purple, if you like.

Predestined to win.

:)

[Harrison Diamond]

Since I price checked a dual Xeon PC configuration, beginning of last year or something like this, it was cheaper to go for a PC config (Skulltrail) than Mac.

I'd be surprised if when Intel releases a PC dual processed motherboard for PC the config would be more expensive.



When you spec out a competing workstation from any major vendor around release time, the Mac Pros tend to be almost universally cheaper or equivalent in price. Skulltrail is a high end consumer platform based off the workstation one. Not saying it isn't a good option, but you have to compare apples to apples, so to speak.

[Granty]

When you spec out a competing workstation from any major vendor around release time, the Mac Pros tend to be almost universally cheaper or equivalent in price. Skulltrail is a high end consumer platform based off the workstation one. Not saying it isn't a good option, but you have to compare apples to apples, so to speak.

I think this is true now, Apple got a bad rap for being expensive because it was when they used their own closed technology. Now they use the same PC technology with that closed Apple OS so the cost will be very close to PC prices as it is made from the same parts, and with a bulk order. They are made in the same Far East production plant as many a PC, do you think Apple will be doing their own triple channel DDR3 memory or placing a Apple sticker on a batch of stock and charging more for this Apple branded stock, as that is also why Apple get a bad wrap on this. They charge over the odds for parts, but almost all companies do this so you can't build your own system from the parts at cost.

But I expect Apple may stop doing workstation's over the next five years, just no profit in it compared to laptop, iPod(iTunes) and iPhone sales, and because of this lifestyle marketing they are losing kudos as a serious tool for development. 20 years ago you wanted to do something creative you needed to have a Mac and almost 100% of professionals used those workstations, now they will have less than 50% creative professional workstation market, and not even a splash on the home workstation market, and this is declining as we speak. This is in part to do with the amazing level playing field of most modern tech and OS frameworks, but also because many people now just see Apple as a fluffy teen centralised marketing brand, and the current global market is the kick it the guts that they have been asking for.

In 1999 Microsoft needed to buy a share in Apple to keep the company afloat, and over the next few years I don't think they will need someone to do that again, but just focus on where the sales and money come from, and it ain't workstations on more, but they may keep them going as a loss leader for more years than they need to, but I wouldn't put my company at such a risk in these times.

[Harrison Diamond]

Apple has the rather enviable position, though, of being extremely strong financially. They have absolutely unbelievable cash reserves and continue to do well despite the economic downturn. Given the fact that they need considerably less R&D on the workstation end nowadays, and still have a huge following in several professional markets, I doubt they'll discontinue the workstation line for a very very long time.

[Granty]

Apple has the rather enviable position, though, of being extremely strong financially. They have absolutely unbelievable cash reserves and continue to do well despite the economic downturn. Given the fact that they need considerably less R&D on the workstation end nowadays, and still have a huge following in several professional markets, I doubt they'll discontinue the workstation line for a very very long time.

Less R&D, no R&D, they aren't a computer hardware computer anymore, it is all OEM builds, if someone was to buy the Apple computer division, not brand or anything else, you are buying a good OS model, and some good designers skills for cases, to be shipped to a OEM builder - it is worthless, only worth the value of the OS. But the ipod, iTunes and iPhone and brand is pure gold. On the computer side Apple is a software company only (and most foresee paid consumer software will be dead in a few years), that is why they don't want anyone putting that software on a self-build, because if people did that routinely then the computer division would be dead overnight.

Apple can pump all the money into a declining workstation market for as all as they want, they did this in the past and almost finished themselves, I think they have learn't a lesson and won't be repeating it, put the money into products that sell, not what you what to sell.

And they may have money in the bank, put if they get too cocky and have a unlucky expensive marketing release on a new product, like iToliet or iBeer for example, it will eat that reserve in one foul swoop.

The decline in Apple workstations started because most geeks are focused on hardware and see software as a bolt on to that, the point that the workstations when Intel and all off-the-self everyone relised that you buy a Mac or buy a PC then you are buying the same thing, but you can just do what you want on a PC and get more cool bolt-ons to install, with greater international compatibility, and the workstation deline started, the laptop and small form Mac's aren't on decline, but the workstations are - once you see the wizard of Oz you lose all respect and see him for what he is, and thus lost the biggest selling point for the workstation, mystic!

[holy_handgrenade]

I guess that's gotta be UK speak there Granty. Here in the states, it's quite the opposite. Apples computer marketshare has grown tremendously over the last 5 years and continues to do so. I cant walk into a creative division in any company and not see Macs, Imacs, and MacPro's all over the place. Market share in the cinema world alone is tremendous becaus of FCP and Shake. Although Shake is now discontinued, it's still fairly widely used, and gaining marketshare because it's finally "affordable" now. All the efforts and marketing throughout the 80's and 90's of pumping schools (K-12 education) with Apple computers has paid off 1000fold. Most of those schools still use Apple computers, and those students went to college and bought into the iLife mentality and have lots of Apple hardware on campuses.

Apple servers and workstations have been gaining ground as the support has been going in for Apple hardware/OSX drivers. In fact, Apple is one of the fastest growing workstation markets in the 3D world, because previously there were no 3d video cards available for them. The Microsoft world is the one that's loosing ground in the creative industrys, with many bigger companys such as ILM and Dreamworks moving thier systems to either OSX or Linux for thier 3d workstations.

From a business standpoint, Apple's fine and aint going anywhere anytime soon.

I'd also like to add that competitivley speaking, for the first time I can remember Apple's workstation class computers are actually quite competitively priced. You can try and compare similarly speced Dell, HP, Compaq systems or go even more specialized into the realms of like Boxx or Alienware and Apple computers on average have been cheaper by a couple hundred dollars.

[Granty]

May I add, nothing wrong with the brand and sales are up on all levels, except international sales of workstations are on decline and have been for years. 15 years ago I'd walk into a studio, and if I saw a PC I'd be surprised, today I walk into studios and some have a 50:50 split and I don't give that a second look. Over the last few years I've been asked by studios, 'what do you want to work on, PC or Mac', I'd have been shocked if someone said that years ago. That is design, same with video, more again with music, and for CGI, 3D or games I'd be shocked to see a single Mac. It is losing kudos as a professional system as the consumer brand grows, I see it everyday. I don't think people realise just how many people used mac's in creative roles 20 years agao, it wasn't a market share it was a white wash, now it is a market share that is going from that dominance in the wrong direction.

[holy_handgrenade]

No worries! :) It just sounded very dire in your post that didn't quite match up with what I see as reality here.

What I'm seeing more so is that Apple's stations are still highly regarded in the professional realms. They're still the dominant player in any kind of graphic design or dtp house (again, like I said that's here stateside) More of your smaller houses that do either very specific tasks or do general stuff are using PC's as an entry point. They want the macs, but for what they do, they cant justify the increased cost for the [edit] percieved [\edit] minimal gains.

The biggest differences that I'm seeing from 10 or 15 years ago is that nearly ALL software is cross platform these days. So if you're a small studio and only have limited funds, once you buy your software you might only have enough for a pc computer, not even workstation class. And for smaller jobs, that may actually be enough. I've heard of small games and 3d studios using GeForce class cards for thier 3d workstations; vs. the FireGL or Quadro cards that are pro workstation cards. The cost to entry is getting lower, which means there's a slight flood of the cheaper or more mainstream systems in the industry. Go to a company that has money and funding for thier infrastructure and they almost always inevitably go the Apple route. Hell, even me, I'm building a PC because I can do that in spurts, throw $500 at a proc one check, $250 at a motherboard another check, etc....Instead of spending $3k+ at once for a system. If I had the available funds, I'd buy the new MacPro dual proc workstation in a heartbeat. But the same goes for a Boxx system too. Those look pretty sweet but simply dont have the cash to throw $5000 at a system.

[shaocaholica]

Since I price checked a dual Xeon PC configuration, beginning of last year or something like this, it was cheaper to go for a PC config (Skulltrail) than Mac.

Dual Xeon != Dual Xeon. The new Mac Pros are using Nehalem Xeons and a dual 1366 board thats pretty sweet.

[Granty]

I think you are right, most do get a PC to save costs with a desire to get a Mac later, but after functioning for a few years and getting to know a system it gets harder to make that leap. I think the studio's that have the money go for Mac, but is easy to get staff that have worked on PC's to move to Mac's than the other way around.

The main differance I see is years ago if I worked on a PC in a design studio, I just wouldn't be able to cut it, I would have been laughed out the building, today I can bring a project together fast on a PC, sometimes faster than someone on a Mac and then it becomes a hate thing, 'You shouldn't be doing that type of work on a Mac'. But if was faster and better than their work should they care, damn right they should.

I also think that the roles of Internet design and people working in both Internet and print design has helped more people to move to PC's, I don't know many Internet professionals that exclusively work on Mac's, I know some but they aren't very technical and wouldn't know a line of code or a Internet protocol if it hit them in the face, they are mainly layout or element designers for the web, these are the ones always coming to you asking for help with a website. Thinking about it now it is maybe the Internet that is forcing cross media designers to go PC, it wouldn't matter if I was doing a print design on a PC or a Mac, but it would matter if I was doing an Internet site on a Mac, but each to their own. In an ideal world I'd have a Mac, PC and Linux setup mainly for testing web work, and I may have this soon.

And many software companies are also starting to ship verions of Mac and PC software in the same box, which is good for everyone.

[geoffreyEUGENEivie]

dont have the cash to throw $5000 at a system.

http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MB535LL/A?mco=NDE4NDIyMQ

More like $10,000. That is what I spent a few years ago, and I just went to the Apple website and entered all of the options and upgrades I wanted, including 30-inch screen and the total came to $9,746.
It is going to cost you about that much.
I am not complaining. I paid 10 grand before and I will pay that much again. But I don't upgrade until it is painful not to.

[holy_handgrenade]

http://store.apple.com/us/configure/MB535LL/A?mco=NDE4NDIyMQ

More like $10,000. That is what I spent a few years ago, and I just went to the Apple website and entered all of the options and upgrades I wanted, including 30-inch screen and the total came to $9,746.
It is going to cost you about that much.
I am not complaining. I paid 10 grand before and I will pay that much again. But I don't upgrade until it is painful not to.

Well, we obviously shop differently. No need to buy the RAM and other goodies, except for maybe a 30" cinema display from Apple. RAM and Video card options are much better aftermarket. None of thier Video cards are on par for what I'm doing. And good lord those HD prices are pretty outrageous. Not going online and just heading over to the local Fry's Electronics I can get 1TB 7200 RPM drives for $99 - they're even cheaper online. $150 for the 10,000 RPM ones. Why would I want to throw $300 at a 1TB drive from apple? And hell, if you want to go cheaper, 500GB drives at Fry's are around $60 for 7200 RPM drives

So, maxing out the CPU and adding a 30" monitor and minimizing everything else, looking at $7500 - still way more than I have the ability to flop down on a system. In a couple years I might be able to without thinking twice, right now though, The most I can "afford" to flop on a system at a time is about $1k-$1.5k.

But, as it is, the base unit with 2 2.66Ghz procs and 6GB of RAM is still $500 cheaper than my first mac. :D That one boasted a speedy 120Mhz processor and 16MB of ram all for $3800